Time to change the deposit scheme?

[maelzoid]

While we're coming up with hare-brained schemes...

What if Wednesday, Thursday and Friday entry had different prices...? Would you pay more to get there earlier. Actually would be a decent way to control the traffic.

[Johnnyseven]

5 hours ago, km9 said:

You can tell that Glastonbury is over 11 months away!

Anybody thinking any payment plan or tier system would make it easier for them is sorely mistaken. If you need help spreading the cost then buy a money box and put £1 a day in it. If you can't trust yourself not to raid it then lock it and give someone the key. If you need the money to buy essentials, it's still there for you.

Also having multiple deadlines by which a % has to be paid would be more constricting and more stressful for the ticket holder.

[The Nal]

Im not good managing money so I want a music festival to sort it out for me klaxon

Edited July 6, 2022 by The Nal

[DeanoL]

13 minutes ago, Johnnyseven said:

Surely this would advantage richer people, they have 3 price brackets to buy a ticket from whereas the poorer ticket buyer only has 1 unless they pay more money just to get a ticket, which defies the object.

It would advantage rich people if they were willing to pay more sure. But it would also allow cheaper tickets to be sold.

It depends what the objective is. There's a difference between making tickets more widely available, and then having them equally available for anyone. If you want the wealthy to pay more, so you can offer a cheaper ticket, you need to offer them something. In this case it'd be a better shot at a ticket.

In the current system say it's £300 a ticket - everyone is equal but if you can't afford £300 you're not coming. Full stop. In a system where you have three equal blocks of tickets priced at £100, £300 and £500 then you open it up to more people. Sure, those willing to pay £500 now have a better chance to get tickets. But those who can't afford £300 still have a chance at the cheaper tickets. They're no longer priced out.

And yeah, you can't stop the well off people also going for the £100 tickets, but if it's three separate sales links on three different servers, everyone on here could open up three windows, one for each, and if the £500 one gets through first, are you going to chance waiting for a cheaper one or just get it while you can. And chances are, the £500 one will get through first because more people will be trying for the cheaper tickets.

[DeanoL]

17 minutes ago, maelzoid said:

While we're coming up with hare-brained schemes...

What if Wednesday, Thursday and Friday entry had different prices...? Would you pay more to get there earlier. Actually would be a decent way to control the traffic.

Hardly hair-brained, it's pretty standard at festivals large and small. 

[Johnnyseven]

8 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

It would advantage rich people if they were willing to pay more sure. But it would also allow cheaper tickets to be sold.

It depends what the objective is. There's a difference between making tickets more widely available, and then having them equally available for anyone. If you want the wealthy to pay more, so you can offer a cheaper ticket, you need to offer them something. In this case it'd be a better shot at a ticket.

In the current system say it's £300 a ticket - everyone is equal but if you can't afford £300 you're not coming. Full stop. In a system where you have three equal blocks of tickets priced at £100, £300 and £500 then you open it up to more people. Sure, those willing to pay £500 now have a better chance to get tickets. But those who can't afford £300 still have a chance at the cheaper tickets. They're no longer priced out.

And yeah, you can't stop the well off people also going for the £100 tickets, but if it's three separate sales links on three different servers, everyone on here could open up three windows, one for each, and if the £500 one gets through first, are you going to chance waiting for a cheaper one or just get it while you can. And chances are, the £500 one will get through first because more people will be trying for the cheaper tickets.

With Glasto though it's going to sell out every year, what you'll get is people who can't afford a £500 ticket buying one to guarantee getting a ticket.

[moogster]

Do you tend to get some kind of year end payment in the UK? I'm not talking big bonus or something, like a couple of percents for Christmas, or even a thirteenth month? (Just asking, I come from countries slightly more social than the UK, if I can describe it like that)

[Johnnyseven]

1 minute ago, moogster said:

Do you tend to get some kind of year end payment in the UK? I'm not talking big bonus or something, like a couple of percents for Christmas, or even a thirteenth month? (Just asking, I come from countries slightly more social than the UK, if I can describe it like that)

Not me.

[Madyaker]

I don't see why the festival should cater to people who can't sort their personal finances. It won't make the festival any cheaper, you can either afford it or you can't. We all know when we are going to have to pay our deposit and balance it's not like the dates change much, there's a slight increase in price year on year but everyone is expecting that. If people want to go but can't just stump a couple hundred quid when the time comes then put a savings plan in place, X amount per week into a savings account or whatever. I used to do that when I started going to festivals as a student.

[MEGATRONICMEATWAGON]

2 hours ago, Johnnyseven said:

What about all the rich folk paying themselves minimum wage through their own limited company?

Does your tax code even change when you move into a higher income tax band?

Yeah, no idea. Like I said to others, it was an on the fly idea, didn't really think too much about it, probably quite unworkable. 

Just tried to think of ideas to guarantee low income attendees/families had a fair chance.

[DeanoL]

1 hour ago, Johnnyseven said:

With Glasto though it's going to sell out every year, what you'll get is people who can't afford a £500 ticket buying one to guarantee getting a ticket.

I'm sure you'd get some and they'd end up having to get a refund when they couldn't pay the balance. 

But like I keep saying time and time again on this thread: people on very low incomes are almost all sensible with money because they can't afford not to be. Those people would give the £100 tickets ago as they know it's their only chance to afford it.

If you even think for a moment you can afford the £500 tickets, you probably can. It just means putting all your disposable income away for a while to save it up. If people want to go that badly, they can go for the more expensive tickets and give up more stuff.

Genuinely low paid people would not go for the £500 quid tickets because they're not delusional about money. The people that you're talking about that "can't afford them" but buy them regardless are people who only can't afford them because they also don't want to give up their current lifestyle for six months to save. 

[squirrelarmy]

1 hour ago, moogster said:

Do you tend to get some kind of year end payment in the UK? I'm not talking big bonus or something

Depends on the company. I’m in the private sector and I get a bonus depending on various conditions. The last few years it’s worked out at around a months salary so it’s not to be sniffed at. 

[DeanoL]

10 minutes ago, MEGATRONICMEATWAGON said:

Yeah, no idea. Like I said to others, it was an on the fly idea, didn't really think too much about it, probably quite unworkable. 

Just tried to think of ideas to guarantee low income attendees/families had a fair chance.

Honestly I think the best way to help genuinely less well off folk is to keep a lot of the volunteering positions back for them. Rather than them going to people who "well, we could have bought a ticket but we just love the experience of volunteering so much". 

The volunteer workforce is just as middle-class as the rest of the festival, and unlike the rest of the festival where the ticket price is a barrier, there's no reason for it to be. Some outreach on the part of the festival and it's volunteering partners to make it clear to those in different economic circumstances that this is how they could get to go to Glastonbury would go a long way.

The term "volunteering" is a loaded one as many see themselves as "too poor to do voluntary work" which is true in the real world, but Glastonbury volunteering is in fact "working for a ticket".

[blutarsky]

22 hours ago, fraybentos1 said:

Would make it more palatable for many

Number one argument against right there. Ticket day is tough enough 😁

[stuie]

20 hours ago, MEGATRONICMEATWAGON said:

What's so scary about people paying what they can afford?

I don't think it'd happen mind you, but the discussion is quite interesting.

It kind of happens already... people with more cash to spend buy pre erected tents / campervan options

[Suprefan]

So what is going to happen when they get to £350 a ticket? £400? Do we see a sudden non instant sell out on the deposit? Or complaints that youre not getting a reflection of the price with the lineup you get. If there was an actual resale market for tickets you would def see what people value a ticket for and it would be both high prices and rock bottom ones.

 

Dont know why they dont try a ticket exchange so that people who cannot go within the last few weeks leading up to the fest cant just put it up, get their money back and somebody else gets their chance rather than leaving it to go to waste.

 

Do we have any statistics on no shows? I mean they can count how many wristbands got distributed, but since tickets dont get scanned thats not info which goes into a database for accuracy.

[DeanoL]

The festival know how many people try for tickets versus how many get them. I think that's the crucial stat. If they know demand is twice supply, they don't have to worry too much about the price. If it's like 1.2x supply, they might need to.

[Johnnyseven]

18 minutes ago, Suprefan said:

Dont know why they dont try a ticket exchange so that people who cannot go within the last few weeks leading up to the fest cant just put it up, get their money back and somebody else gets their chance rather than leaving it to go to waste.

This is a good idea. I guess the only reason they don't do it is that it'll cost money to implement for no extra return for the festival. I guess they could charge an admin fee for the ticket returner though but you can't really charge the buyer any more in admin fees that you charge a first time ticket buyer.

[efcfanwirral]

27 minutes ago, Suprefan said:

Dont know why they dont try a ticket exchange so that people who cannot go within the last few weeks leading up to the fest cant just put it up, get their money back and somebody else gets their chance rather than leaving it to go to waste.

 

Do we have any statistics on no shows? I mean they can count how many wristbands got distributed, but since tickets dont get scanned thats not info which goes into a database for accuracy.

Yeah this is what I think too - it ensures all tickets go to good homes, and as we know from the people who can't get tickets on here - they're gutted and the chance is completely 100% gone (apart from competitions) after resale day. I'd definitely keep time booked off and be willing to get down there right at the very last minute if I hadn't got a ticket, and I think a lot of others here would too. 

In the same spirit as not allocating every ticket randomly within 2 seconds on ticket day, it would help those who are desperate to be there to make it there. 

[Suprefan]

1 hour ago, Johnnyseven said:

This is a good idea. I guess the only reason they don't do it is that it'll cost money to implement for no extra return for the festival. I guess they could charge an admin fee for the ticket returner though but you can't really charge the buyer any more in admin fees that you charge a first time ticket buyer.

I think they could charge the buyer an extra fee for purchasing an exchange ticket. Say £25 because its "last minute". I doubt anyone would have an issue of paying that bump. You just ensure the returner gets their money back aside from admin fees in doing so. 

Other fests do fan to fan exchange and set standards on how to price. All Glasto has to do is make it the cost and put the extra bump. And they wont even have to go to the trouble of mail and relegate it to box office ( which wont be a mess next time ) so collection is at least assured and youre not scrambling to get it via post.

The only other thing is that you have a cutoff as to when the tickets can be up for grabs. I would think the Friday before would suffice. If you got a ticket 5 days before the fest youre likely in the country and have the means to get there or had been planning. Finding a ride or just getting a coach might be the only obstacle, but people have gone to more extremes to get to the fest before

Edited July 6, 2022 by Suprefan

[March Hare]

1 hour ago, DeanoL said:

The festival know how many people try for tickets versus how many get them. I think that's the crucial stat. If they know demand is twice supply, they don't have to worry too much about the price. If it's like 1.2x supply, they might need to.

The 50 pairs of tickets in the draw after the October 2019 sale was a cynical data gathering exercise to determine how much of the traffic hitting the website was people interested in attending.

It allowed the festival to separate people with multiple devices from people with registrations who wanted a ticket.

successful sales + registrations entered in the draw = demand

It wasn’t the festival doing something nice for those who missed out on tickets - which is how it was positioned 

Edited July 6, 2022 by March Hare

[incident]

3 hours ago, DeanoL said:

Honestly I think the best way to help genuinely less well off folk is to keep a lot of the volunteering positions back for them. Rather than them going to people who "well, we could have bought a ticket but we just love the experience of volunteering so much". 

The volunteer workforce is just as middle-class as the rest of the festival, and unlike the rest of the festival where the ticket price is a barrier, there's no reason for it to be. Some outreach on the part of the festival and it's volunteering partners to make it clear to those in different economic circumstances that this is how they could get to go to Glastonbury would go a long way.

The term "volunteering" is a loaded one as many see themselves as "too poor to do voluntary work" which is true in the real world, but Glastonbury volunteering is in fact "working for a ticket".

There's not really any need to hold positions back - getting a space isn't a problem for anyone prepared to keep an eye open, as there's always cancellations close to the festival. I do think you've slightly misread the demographic as well - the "I'd only ever volunteer" types are a small (but yeah, vocal) minority - amongst the groups that recruit publicly (Oxfam, Festaff, Shelter, WaterAid, etc), the biggest single demographic of volunteers are students who do it for 2-3 years or so while money is tight, and only a small percentage of them keep volunteering when they're earning a salary.

The bigger obstacle is that nearly everyone taking volunteers (WBC being the only exception I'm aware of, and they don't recruit publicly) still require the full ticket price as a deposit which creates the same problem if short term cashflow is the issue.

[gfa]

2 hours ago, Johnnyseven said:

This is a good idea. I guess the only reason they don't do it is that it'll cost money to implement for no extra return for the festival. I guess they could charge an admin fee for the ticket returner though but you can't really charge the buyer any more in admin fees that you charge a first time ticket buyer.

This is a bit short-sighted, there's probably at least 1000 wasted tickets every year - if each person spends on average £200 over the weekend thats £200,000 less being spent on bars, food vendors etc etc. It wouldn't be hard at all to partner with twickets etc

[MEGATRONICMEATWAGON]

3 hours ago, stuie said:

It kind of happens already... people with more cash to spend buy pre erected tents / campervan options

I guess I meant in the context of a tier system for low income spenders to high-earners etc. Although in doing research I was really surprised how many glamping sites there are around Glasto, as well as some of them offering guaranteed tickets...

It's another world for some.

[a6l6e6x]

I think they should increase it to £100 deposit so clearing the balance isn't as painful

But I'm terrible at money management