2023 line up thread

[Guy Incognito]

10 minutes ago, Jeel said:

Value for money against other festivals (or anything else priced at £200 plus travel).

If you look at the headliners they had previously it's poor in comparison to most years.

2015 - Sufjan Stevens, The War on Drugs, Tame Impala

2016 - Joanna Newsom, Bat for Lashes, Animal Collective, The Shins

2018 - Vampire Weekend, St Vincent, Feist

It's fine using the Glastonbury line about the experience, but in the middle of a cost of living crisis £200 is a lot of money for a week of camping. 

It's interesting that you have picked only three out of the last seven festivals for comparison. Perhaps implying that the headliners this year are poor in comparison to those three years, but not the other four. 

[The Nal]

27 minutes ago, Jeel said:

Value for money against other festivals (or anything else priced at £200 plus travel).

If you look at the headliners they had previously it's poor in comparison to most years.

2015 - Sufjan Stevens, The War on Drugs, Tame Impala

2016 - Joanna Newsom, Bat for Lashes, Animal Collective, The Shins

2018 - Vampire Weekend, St Vincent, Feist

It's fine using the Glastonbury line about the experience, but in the middle of a cost of living crisis £200 is a lot of money for a week of camping. 

Id take Wilco and King Gizz over any of those years

[Jeel]

1 hour ago, Guy Incognito said:

It's interesting that you have picked only three out of the last seven festivals for comparison. Perhaps implying that the headliners this year are poor in comparison to those three years, but not the other four. 

I think they're probably poor in relation to any year, but those years stand out a lot more. 

[Guy Incognito]

8 minutes ago, Jeel said:

I think they're probably poor in relation to any year, but those years stand out a lot more. 

I don't disagree to be fair. 

Good thing that this year's line up has more depth than most. 

[Jeel]

43 minutes ago, Guy Incognito said:

I don't disagree to be fair. 

Good thing that this year's line up has more depth than most. 

I think we'll only know that when the full line-up is announced. 

It's a sparse and very thin second tier of acts at the moment. There's always lots to discover in the bottom bit, but that's the glaring weakness at the moment. 

[jplewes]

2 hours ago, Jeel said:

“In our niche world, how many [female acts] can headline a Green Man or End of the Road? There aren’t many.”

Both a terrible abdication of responsibility and a total cop-out. 

 

Yeah not sure on that quote/question, seems a bit ick.  Although fair enough he wanted Angel Olsen to do it but she wanted to be on the Garden, and sounds like did line up a female act to headline but they signed an exclusivity deal somewhere else.

Simon is also right in terms of the gender balance of the rest of the lineup.

 

Edited March 6, 2023 by jplewes

[Thruxton Appleby]

5 hours ago, Jeel said:

“In our niche world, how many [female acts] can headline a Green Man or End of the Road? There aren’t many.”

Both a terrible abdication of responsibility and a total cop-out. 

 

Interesting. A few years ago, I was virtually run out of town for daring to suggest on this forum that there was a dearth of female acts at headline level (specifically after we had just had Joanna Newsome headlining for the second time and St Vincent for the third time within not many years). I'm not sure how Simon Taffe can be blamed for this just because he has recognised it. I don't think any other festival has gone to such lengths to at least try and achieve an even gender split. But still, he's a bit off-message, so let's get him!

[noisenoiseandmorenoise]

6 hours ago, Jeel said:

Value for money against other festivals (or anything else priced at £200 plus travel).

If you look at the headliners they had previously it's poor in comparison to most years.

2015 - Sufjan Stevens, The War on Drugs, Tame Impala

2016 - Joanna Newsom, Bat for Lashes, Animal Collective, The Shins

2018 - Vampire Weekend, St Vincent, Feist

It's fine using the Glastonbury line about the experience, but in the middle of a cost of living crisis £200 is a lot of money for a week of camping. 

I don't really see the point of the last paragraph. Again the implication seems to be that they are cynically overcharging which is clearly nonsense. Festivals cost what they cost, they are not charities.

Of the lineups you named, the later was criticized for being weak and trying to shoe-horn female headliners. The Joanna Newsom year is notorious for complaints that they over indulged her at the cost of the rest of the lineup.

None of which I necessarily agree with, more to say that what you present as some sort of objective evidence for this year being rubbish is as subjective as any other year 

[Jeel]

40 minutes ago, noisenoiseandmorenoise said:

I don't really see the point of the last paragraph. Again the implication seems to be that they are cynically overcharging which is clearly nonsense. Festivals cost what they cost, they are not charities.

Of the lineups you named, the later was criticized for being weak and trying to shoe-horn female headliners. The Joanna Newsom year is notorious for complaints that they over indulged her at the cost of the rest of the lineup.

None of which I necessarily agree with, more to say that what you present as some sort of objective evidence for this year being rubbish is as subjective as any other year 

I've never said anything like EOTR are cynically overcharging? I said that for £200 I'd expect better. 

[Jeel]

1 hour ago, Thruxton Appleby said:

Interesting. A few years ago, I was virtually run out of town for daring to suggest on this forum that there was a dearth of female acts at headline level (specifically after we had just had Joanna Newsome headlining for the second time and St Vincent for the third time within not many years). I'm not sure how Simon Taffe can be blamed for this just because he has recognised it. I don't think any other festival has gone to such lengths to at least try and achieve an even gender split. But still, he's a bit off-message, so let's get him!

He said there aren't many female/part-female bands/acts which can rival UMO or Future Islands, which is obviously nonsense. That's my criticism. EOTR has historically been good in that aspect, but that quote is blatantly incorrect. 

[Thruxton Appleby]

5 minutes ago, Jeel said:

He said there aren't many female/part-female bands/acts which can rival UMO or Future Islands, which is obviously nonsense. That's my criticism. EOTR has historically been good in that aspect, but that quote is blatantly incorrect. 

I have no idea what UMO are doing headlining, so with you there. But female artists who would fit with EotR, are big enough to headline, and haven't already done so? Name names. Oh, and they would have to be available, affordable and not subject to exclusivity clauses.

[Jeel]

32 minutes ago, Thruxton Appleby said:

I have no idea what UMO are doing headlining, so with you there. But female artists who would fit with EotR, are big enough to headline, and haven't already done so? Name names. Oh, and they would have to be available, affordable and not subject to exclusivity clauses.

Off the top of my head you have acts kicking around like:

Little Simz, Big Thief, YYYs, PJ Harvey, Wapaint, Chvrches, Lucinda Williams, Blondie, Patti Smith

If you're being a bit more leftfield

Susanne Sundfor, Alison Goldfrapp, Caroline Polachek, Fever Ray, The Moldy Peaches, 

And given I assume everyone (including Simon) would be happy with Taylor Swift, then it opens up a whole new avenue of pop stars. 

I have no idea if they're available, affordable etc but there are undoubtedly acts/bands who can do it if Future Islands is the bar. 

 

Edited March 6, 2023 by Jeel

[Thruxton Appleby]

3 minutes ago, Jeel said:

Off the top of my head you have acts kicking around like:

Little Simz, Big Thief, YYYs, PJ Harvey, Wapaint, Chvrches, Lucinda Williams, Blondie, Patti Smith

If you're being a bit more leftfield

Susanne Sundfor, Alison Goldfrapp, Caroline Polachek, Fever Ray, The Moldy Peaches, 

And given I assume everyone (including Simon) would be happy with Taylor Swift, then it opens up a whole new avenue of pop stars. 

I don't think saying there are no female acts who can do it when you're booking them is acceptable. 

 

I can't believe YYYs or PJH wouldn't have been booked if they were available (and within budget). Can't go along with the idea of Blondie, it's not the Isle of Wight after all. And many of the rest of your first list have played before. The "leftfield" list, fine, but as main stage headliners? Nah. And if we're opening up a whole new avenue of pop stars I may as well go to (insert your choice of name from endless list of mainstream festivals).

I agree with your posts about the weakness of the lineup as a whole btw. We have come to expect better. 

[Yoss]

This is getting very silly. Being able to name female acts who "could" headline is a long way from saying that the festival could have got them. If it's the case there are fewer of them then there are going to be fewer options available.

Anyway, bored of this now. I'm going to have a great weekend.

[Meades93]

18 hours ago, Jeel said:

Value for money against other festivals (or anything else priced at £200 plus travel).

If you look at the headliners they had previously it's poor in comparison to most years.

2015 - Sufjan Stevens, The War on Drugs, Tame Impala

2016 - Joanna Newsom, Bat for Lashes, Animal Collective, The Shins

2018 - Vampire Weekend, St Vincent, Feist

It's fine using the Glastonbury line about the experience, but in the middle of a cost of living crisis £200 is a lot of money for a week of camping. 

As you say, it’s a cost of living crisis. Emily Eavis recently said that to put on the same show at Glastonbury as previous years it would mean a £100 increase in tickets. They’ve had to up tickets by about £55 as the minimum they could do. £200 is a lot, but I think it’s still worth it for the experience. 
 

When looking at past years line ups, a lot of those acts are so much bigger now then when they headlined EOTR. In that Guardian article it pretty much says that Simon aims for bands who can sell out Brixton when looking at headliners. If you look at having headliners at an average ticket price of £40, then just seeing those four headliners is £160 worth of value. I’d also argue that what we have this year in terms of headliners  is stronger than 2019, 2020 (initial announcement), and 2021.

The state of the festival industry is also much  harder for independent  festivals like EOTR. You can hypothetically go to a festival like Truck or Victorious and get better “value”, but as part of Superstruct they do big multi festival deals for acts. The same with live nation and festival republic.  This to me just means that most festival line ups these days are copy and pasted. It all becomes so generic. It probably doesn’t help that Goldenvoice have moved All Points East to August. They can afford to pay more money, and will get exclusivity agreements. 

I don’t really want to dwell on the value aspect too much more. I think it’s value for money. The cost of living crisis does mean that people will be more frugal with their festival choices. It also means that independent festivals are going to struggle the most. I went in 2019, and missed 2021 due to a newborn, but I remember the feeling of going last year, and thinking about how we almost lost that kind of experience during the lockdown. It’s amazing that festivals like EOTR are still going. It seems like there are line up complaints for almost every festival this year. It might just be an off year for some. It’s fine to be disappointed about the line up, everyone’s got a personal preference, but no one has been swindled out of a festival ticket here. 

[Hurray4theWhiffWhaff]

Absolutely. Watch the video of Margo Cilker singing Tom Waits at the piano stage.  It’s magical & for me these are the moments that EOTR are all about, not the headliners.  I would pay £200 just to spend the weekend at the piano stage 🙂

[jplewes]

Protomartyr announced new record and a Brudenell date in Aug (although maybe a bit early...). They're sort of in that middle category of stuff I've heard/would enjoy rather than headliner or something I've never heard of, so wouldn't mind.

https://twitter.com/protomartyrband/status/1633121575867400192?s=20

[Guy Incognito]

3 hours ago, jplewes said:

Protomartyr announced new record and a Brudenell date in Aug (although maybe a bit early...). They're sort of in that middle category of stuff I've heard/would enjoy rather than headliner or something I've never heard of, so wouldn't mind.

https://twitter.com/protomartyrband/status/1633121575867400192?s=20

Think they're unlikely to stick around for a couple weeks after their last UK date just for EOTR. Shame as theyre a great band and were excellent in Big Top a few years back. 

[Meades93]

Still have my fingers crossed for Bdrmm, saw them last year in Guildford and thought they were great and would go down well. See that they are playing Long Division in July and a smattering of other dates. Hopefully they make an appearance on the second announcement.

[wolfamongwolves]

47 minutes ago, Guy Incognito said:

Think they're unlikely to stick around for a couple weeks after their last UK date just for EOTR. Shame as theyre a great band and were excellent in Big Top a few years back. 

They were super in big top. Great band 

[Guy Incognito]

1 hour ago, Meades93 said:

Still have my fingers crossed for Bdrmm, saw them last year in Guildford and thought they were great and would go down well. See that they are playing Long Division in July and a smattering of other dates. Hopefully they make an appearance on the second announcement.

They got a pretty decent slot in 2021 so may be unlikely to be back so soon. 

[Meades93]

9 hours ago, Guy Incognito said:

They got a pretty decent slot in 2021 so may be unlikely to be back so soon. 

Ah fair enough. I was also wondering if any names would have been held back due to Wide Awake. It’s an early festival so would still leave EOTR plenty of time to sell tickets. I know last year that a few EOTR records bands played it, but there’s not too much crossover at the moment in terms of acts. 

[SweepingTheNation]

Some actual line-up news - Marie Davidson's booking agent's site says she's DJing on the Friday.

[jplewes]

15 minutes ago, SweepingTheNation said:

Some actual line-up news - Marie Davidson's booking agent's site says she's DJing on the Friday.

I think she was a 2021 cancellation, right?

[SweepingTheNation]

14 minutes ago, jplewes said:

I think she was a 2021 cancellation, right?

Yes she was, although that was with her live band project L’œil Nu.