Football 2023/24

[thetime]

17 minutes ago, Neil said:

released now! 🙂 

Just a big f**k up.

No conspiracy, no agenda against Liverpool. 

[charlierc]

1 hour ago, Skip997 said:

The problem with the Diaz goal had absolutely nothing to do with a failure of the VAR technology.

Being kind it was an error of judgement by 5 humans.

In reality.....

This feels like wanting it to be evidence of a specific anti-Liverpool agenda rather than a definite belief in it, even though there were multiple incidents last season of the VAR process being done incorrectly for offsides. On the same day in February, Brighton had a goal incorrectly disallowed as the lines were drawn from the wrong player, while Brentford had a goal incorrectly allowed due to the VAR not bothering to do the lines. Both big errors, very much screwing over teams not called Liverpool.

As it is, I watched the video the PL/PGMOL released. It showed them hurrying it without thinking, and it only sinking in when their replay operator said just as the game restarted "Decision given was offside, are you sure you want to confirm it?", and the VAR twice going "Oh f**k" when it hit him that he'd f**ked up. Especially as the current rules means that they can't then consequently go to the officials "Hold on, we've got this wrong". Hints that the desperation to make the VAR offside review as quickly as possible saw them goof it.

Edited October 3, 2023 by charlierc

[Skip997]

We'll see, it might take years, but it'll come out.

Yes folks, the "clean as a whistle" "best league in the worldTM" is corrupt.

Don't think it's possible? How about Italy and Spain?

There's too much money involved for there to be no corruption.

[Skip997]

Okay so let's just accept for a moment that the decision regarding the Diaz goal was the worst case of incompitence seen in the era of VAR.

What about the Jones red card? When the ref was asked to look at the monitor the first image he was shown was a still of Jones foot on the Spurs players ankle, no context at all. This is the image and angle which gives the worst possible look to the incident and immediately plants a ssed in the refs mind.

This is also against PL rules/protocol:

The referee can request different cameras angles/replay speeds but, in
general, slow-motion replays should only be used for facts, e.g. position of
offence/player, point of contact for physical offences and handball, ball out of
play (including goal/no goal); normal speed should be used for the ‘intensity’
of an offence or to decide if it was a handball offence.

I have never seen a still being used as first image in such a review before. It always starts with a full speed video clip. Mr England (VAR) did his best to influence the refs decision and effectively set up the sending off.

This is the real "elephant in the room".

[Skip997]

Paddy Power paying out on all Luis Diaz related winning bets after hearing the audio.
Hope that £10k bet was with them.

[charlierc]

31 minutes ago, Skip997 said:

What about the Jones red card? When the ref was asked to look at the monitor the first image he was shown was a still of Jones foot on the Spurs players ankle, no context at all. This is the image and angle which gives the worst possible look to the incident and immediately plants a ssed in the refs mind.

 

Officially announced in the last 2 hours that the appeal against that red has been rejected and Jones will serve a 3 game ban. Which has gone down with some Liverpool fans about as well as I expected it to, although more have been willing to accept this one than the goal that wasn't and the Jota red, which are both more clear-cut problematic.

This apparently happened with Chelsea's Malo Gusto the week before, so if that's the precedent, it's an example to follow. I've seen a few complain the still image was first, which sure, makes it look worse, but that's happened before as well.

[pink_triangle]

If this is an anti Liverpool conspiracy there would be a lot easier way to do i then via a VAR room where everything is recorded.

[balti-pie]

17 hours ago, Skip997 said:

We'll see, it might take years, but it'll come out.

Yes folks, the "clean as a whistle" "best league in the worldTM" is corrupt.

Don't think it's possible? How about Italy and Spain?

There's too much money involved for there to be no corruption.

Go on then: is it PGMOL who hate Liverpool? If so, why have you had a slew of decisions go your way? I'm thinking most instantly of Wolves being denied a winner, Szoboslai (spelling? christ thats hard to spell) diving for a pen this season, and Jota being permitted to boot Skipp in the head leaving a twelve inch wound without that being a red card, and subsequently scoring a 95th min winner. And thats the three pulled off the top of me head, i'm sure there's others. Or have PGMOL just started taking bribes to knock you off? 

Have Spurs paid off the refs? Because no, we dont particularly care about Liverpool, we'd have needed to have bribed the week before, cos arsenal is a much bigger game for us. 

Is it Man City? why didnt they pay off their own game, and concentrate on yours instead? 

Is it shady southeast asian betting comps? because disallowing a 34th min goal doesnt sort out a scoreline. 

Is this Le Tissier style 'dark forces' that you're not willing to divulge, lest they track you down too? Because if so, i've got some tremendous anti-psychotic medication here and i think you should have a couple. 

[Skip997]

5 minutes ago, balti-pie said:

Go on then: is it PGMOL who hate Liverpool?

It's basically the whole country, except those who live there (Evertonians excepted)

Ever thought why Liverpool fans may be suspicious of the football authorities and the government?

Remember this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillsborough_disaster

Took nigh on 30 years to get the truth out, but there are still people out there who believe it was Liverpool fans fault.

Still hopefully this latest outrage spurs them on to destroy all teams and stroll to being PL champs.

[balti-pie]

Personally speaking, i dont have any issue with Liverpool at all, in fact the Spurs and Liverpool fans got on famously over in madrid for the 2019 final, with not a shred of trouble whatsoever. I wouldnt have anticipated that with almost any other British club. I think this siege mentality is a load of divisive nonsense to be honest with you. Do you really feel the whole country hate Liverpool? I mean, REALLY? Is that not a bit Main Character syndrome? I think the majority of southern-based football fans barely ever think about them, aside from twice a season when they play. Sorry to burst your bubble. 

And i thought you were chasing this PGMOL wrong in order to improve football for everyone, a wonderful selfless act? Because you then say that you hope to destroy all teams. Thats slightly incongruous, no? Do you want to help everyone or crush them? Or are you fitting your argument to whatever you can think of at the time? 

[Neil]

1 minute ago, balti-pie said:

Personally speaking, i dont have any issue with Liverpool at all, in fact the Spurs and Liverpool fans got on famously over in madrid for the 2019 final, with not a shred of trouble whatsoever. I wouldnt have anticipated that with almost any other British club. I think this siege mentality is a load of divisive nonsense to be honest with you. Do you really feel the whole country hate Liverpool? I mean, REALLY? Is that not a bit Main Character syndrome? I think the majority of southern-based football fans barely ever think about them, aside from twice a season when they play. Sorry to burst your bubble. 

And i thought you were chasing this PGMOL wrong in order to improve football for everyone, a wonderful selfless act? Because you then say that you hope to destroy all teams. Thats slightly incongruous, no? Do you want to help everyone or crush them? Or are you fitting your argument to whatever you can think of at the time? 

its just more of the victim syndrome that's liked in liverpool.

[thetime]

Jurgen Klopp demands Liverpool replay against Tottenham after VAR error disallowed Luis Diaz goal | Football News | Sky Sports

[Neil]

5 minutes ago, thetime said:

Jurgen Klopp demands Liverpool replay against Tottenham after VAR error disallowed Luis Diaz goal | Football News | Sky Sports

i think that's the best solution if there's going to be a solution (with the original game voided [ spurs lose three points].)

[Skip997]

12 minutes ago, thetime said:

Jurgen Klopp demands Liverpool replay against Tottenham after VAR error disallowed Luis Diaz goal | Football News | Sky Sports

Unsurprisingly the media has deliberately misquoted. He did not DEMAND a replay, he suggested that was the best solution. 

Of course as usual he's correct.

If Spurs want then start at 34 minutes? (when Jones was sent off), Liverpool with only 10 men.

Edited October 4, 2023 by Skip997

[balti-pie]

where was this Replay energy from Klopp when Wolves were robbed of a winner there last season?

Oh yeah, it wasnt there . . .  

[Skip997]

57 minutes ago, balti-pie said:

where was this Replay energy from Klopp when Wolves were robbed of a winner there last season?

Oh yeah, it wasnt there . . .  

I'm sick of banging my head against a wall and trying to explain to fans of other clubs that this fight Liverpool are putting up is ultimately for the good of all teams.

There won't be a replay, Liverpool will gain absolutely nothing out of this. Chances are they'll lose out as refs "take revenge".

Seriously if people can't see the difference between countless other subjective VAR decisions and 100% objective decision, then frankly they haven't got a clue and don't deserve the changes that will inevitably come from this.

By the way I've got no idea what supposed winner you're on about, but I'd be surprised if someone was obviously and comfortably 1m onside.

This pathetic "whataboutery" is helping no one.

Just have to accept that you either don't understand or don't care about what's actually happening here.

Edited October 4, 2023 by Skip997

[balti-pie]

LOL 😄

you're doing it for every club, but don't care about any other club. Riiiiight. You dont care about other instances of being being robbed, because nobody else has been as robbed as you. Riiiight. You've conveniently deleted any memory of your team doing over another a few months back via a dreadful VAR decision, because - actually, i dont know why.  

In summary then: nobody has ever suffered as much as Liverpool FC, and we cant give any instances because you don't care, or you don't remember. This is fascinating debate. The actual Liverpool fans i know are a bit more nuanced in their discussions, you're just mooing at a page. 

 

 

 

[Skip997]

3 minutes ago, balti-pie said:

LOL 😄

you're doing it for every club, but don't care about any other club. Riiiiight. You dont care about other instances of being being robbed, because nobody else has been as robbed as you. Riiiight. You've conveniently deleted any memory of your team doing over another a few months back via a dreadful VAR decision, because - actually, i dont know why.  

In summary then: nobody has ever suffered as much as Liverpool FC, and we cant give any instances because you don't care, or you don't remember. This is fascinating debate. The actual Liverpool fans i know are a bit more nuanced in their discussions, you're just mooing at a page.

You really don't see the difference between this objective decisions and other completely subjective decisions?

Presume you've not heard the audio either?

 

[balti-pie]

7 minutes ago, Skip997 said:

You really don't see the difference between this objective decisions and other completely subjective decisions?

Presume you've not heard the audio either?

 

The linesman flagged it as offside. It there was no VAR it would have been disallowed and just been remembered as a wrongly disallowed goal. As it is, the VAR knacked up the communication and a previously wrong decision wasnt righted. Brighton had a goal ruled out for offside because the VAR drew the line from the wrong defender. Arsenal had a goal wrongly given against them because VAR didnt bother to draw any lines, and that cost them two points in a title race at the time and even they didnt moan as much. Every club gets ropey decisions, you are not the first and you wont be the last, no matter what VAR promise there is and always will be human error. 

Can i moan about Pedro Mendes' goal at Old Trafford yet? That was three foot over the bloody line. 

Basically, everyone thinks their club is the hard done by club, and its not true for anyone. Suck it up and use it as motivation.  

[thetime]

[Skip997]

4 minutes ago, thetime said:

 

With the originals line ups?

That'd be a laugh

 

[charlierc]

This is such a bizarre idea on so many levels.

I know it was also announced today that the UK/Ireland bid for Euro 2028 is now the only bid as Turkey have retracted their bid to focus on co-hosting Euro 2032 with Italy, which also is an odd sentence on paper.

[thetime]

1 hour ago, Skip997 said:

With the originals line ups?

That'd be a laugh

 

Would take that Milan defence now, rather than uniteds defence. 

[Skip997]

1 minute ago, charlierc said:

This is such a bizarre idea on so many levels.

I know it was also announced today that the UK/Ireland bid for Euro 2028 is now the only bid as Turkey have retracted their bid to focus on co-hosting Euro 2032 with Italy, which also is an odd sentence on paper.

Bizarre is one way of putting it.

Disgraceful is another

[charlierc]

1 hour ago, thetime said:

I think this gets to the heart of it. Why not also replay the game when Henry's hand knocked Ireland out of the World Cup? Or Maradona's handball or that one where Pedro Mendes' shot was fumbled by Roy Carroll, or just create a list that goes on and on and on? Where exactly do you draw the line with this?

At the very least I don't recall Brighton or Arsenal saying they wanted replays after the twin f**k-ups on the same weekend in February, or at least, not to the same extent. The nature of being somebody who works for any football team means the words are only going to look partisan, and indeed, if Liverpool are the beneficiary of a VAR error in the future (which knowing what VAR is like, can't be ruled out), it'll just lead to other people's fans joining in saying "Where's our replay then Jurgen?". Really, we've spent too much time talking about this, and there comes a point where the issue needs to be split away from the Spurs-Liverpool context into asking what can generally be done better. That clip was just of miscommunication as a gateway to mutual incompetence, not any conspiracy, case closed.

After all, given yesterday gave us a Man United Champions League collapse, Arsenal having a stumble in France, or Bellingham and Valverde scoring some wonder goals against Napoli, big football world hasn't exactly stopped for this one mistake.

Edited October 4, 2023 by charlierc