Football 2023/24

[charlierc]

52 minutes ago, Gnomicide said:

Worth noting that without VAR, the f**k up in the Spurs v Liverpool game wouldn't have happened.

 

The linesman would have gone with offside, Liverpool fans would have bitched and moaned about it but ultimately, without all the line drawing bollocks, it would have just been "one of them" and would probably now be forgotten about.

I guess we're still in that "be careful what you wish for" phrase. I remember several people during the 2018/19 season saying that VAR couldn't come soon enough, with that being the last season before the Premier League introduced it, and then since 2019/20 and VAR's arrival, seemingly every week has at least one game immediately given over to a lengthy and interminable discourse about it, and referees in general.

 

I do wonder if there's an end point though. If people are no longer wanting to be referees because of such a comic amount of scrutiny placed on them, are we not headed for a point where there could be a referee supply issue?

[charlierc]

21 minutes ago, thetime said:

Marginal.

 

Offside yes, offside is offside no matter how marginal or what team it is. 

I think there's been worse examples of the toenail-off-no-goal than that. Some Arsenal fans pointed out that's on Gabriel managing to twist his body in such a way in quick time that he was able to play Garnacho off.

 

What price we carry on moaning when the Premier League follows the Champions League in bringing in a semi-automated offside system next season?

[DareToDibble]

On 4/19/2024 at 8:15 PM, thetime said:

 

He is one of those players that fans love to death, apposing fans just hate. A bit like Cantona, Costa, Tevez, Shearer that sort of player. 

 

Love a sh*t housery player myself.

 

There are so many of these. Just off the top of my head we've had loads. Suarez undoubtedly top of the list but even some "lesser" offenders like Bellamy and Robertson.

 

5 hours ago, Gnomicide said:

Worth noting that without VAR, the f**k up in the Spurs v Liverpool game wouldn't have happened.

 

The linesman would have gone with offside, Liverpool fans would have bitched and moaned about it but ultimately, without all the line drawing bollocks, it would have just been "one of them" and would probably now be forgotten about.

 

Not sure I agree. I'm still raging about Sterling being given offside when he played for us v City 😄 

 

4 hours ago, thetime said:

Liverpool fans forgetting about it? Not having that. 

As above tbf.

[thetime]

8 hours ago, charlierc said:

I think there's been worse examples of the toenail-off-no-goal than that. Some Arsenal fans pointed out that's on Gabriel managing to twist his body in such a way in quick time that he was able to play Garnacho off.

 

 

 

There's many toe nail decisions. 

 

Where do you draw the line though? Wenger mentioned a good, clear air between bodies for offside. 

 

On the plus side, no boring games involving utd no more with 30 goals in 6 games. 

[pink_triangle]

13 minutes ago, thetime said:

 

There's many toe nail decisions. 

 

Where do you draw the line though? Wenger mentioned a good, clear air between bodies for offside. 

 

On the plus side, no boring games involving utd no more with 30 goals in 6 games. 

Another question is how confident are we that they draw the line at the correct fraction of a second when ball makes contact with boot.
 

To me the decision yesterday was down to the rules and not an inbuilt bias to protect the elite. VAR was not brought in to correct these types of decision which nobody really complained about. However the fact it in theory allows “perfection “ has seen these kind of decisions dragged in.

[Gnomicide]

5 hours ago, DareToDibble said:

 

There are so many of these. Just off the top of my head we've had loads. Suarez undoubtedly top of the list but even some "lesser" offenders like Bellamy and Robertson.

 

 

Not sure I agree. I'm still raging about Sterling being given offside when he played for us v City 😄 

 

As above tbf.

 

OK, so maybe forgotten about was a stretch 😁

 

But it was a close one, one that would be difficult to say for sure with the naked eye, and like may of them, they may still get brought up but it doesn't come close to the rage about a goal that the officials actually said was good but then didn't give anyway.

[The Nal]

16 hours ago, pink_triangle said:

 
It’s an example of correcting a problem that didn’t exist. It’s so marginal the Coventry player got no advantage. It just sucked the emotion out of the game.

 

And even the Coventry celebrations were slightly subdued as theres always a chance it'll be pulled back. 

 

His baby toe being offside 10 seonds previously gave Coventry no advantage and it ruined what would've been one of the greatest moments in FA Cup history and the history of the club.

[charlierc]

15 hours ago, DareToDibble said:

Not sure I agree. I'm still raging about Sterling being given offside when he played for us v City 😄 

 

I can guess as such. A few weeks later, Newcastle played Man City and had an equaliser chalked off due to questions about an offside player interfering with Hart's vision that most people at the time thought was a bullshit reason, and which I think of as still annoying.

 

But then that's the nature of it. Referees are part of the football mythology, for better or worse.

[charlierc]

11 hours ago, pink_triangle said:

Another question is how confident are we that they draw the line at the correct fraction of a second when ball makes contact with boot.
 

To me the decision yesterday was down to the rules and not an inbuilt bias to protect the elite. VAR was not brought in to correct these types of decision which nobody really complained about. However the fact it in theory allows “perfection “ has seen these kind of decisions dragged in.

I think part of it is how VAR was sold. It seemed to be that before VAR was introduced to the Premier League, it was being billed as a magic elixir that would fix everything, whereas in reality, new technology has just helped to magnify deficiencies with the existing system. It's basically like something out of Black Mirror, albeit significantly more mundane than any of the twisted visions that show has created.

 

It is certainly curious as to how offside has been re-framed from being this subjective call to being something that requires hyper-precision to call, and even then, tweak the line one inch or two to the left or right and you totally flip the outcome, which makes even that more difficult. And like I said, I'm not sure pivoting to the Champions League's semi-automated offside system next season is going to smooth out all of the bumps.

[charlierc]

11 hours ago, thetime said:

On the plus side, no boring games involving utd no more with 30 goals in 6 games. 

I mean, if you keep letting opposition have 15+ or even 20+ shots a game, it's one way to guarantee that games don't end 0-0.

[thetime]

4 minutes ago, charlierc said:

I mean, if you keep letting opposition have 15+ or even 20+ shots a game, it's one way to guarantee that games don't end 0-0.

Fun though. 

[charlierc]

42 minutes ago, thetime said:

Fun though. 

Hey Newcastle have scored and conceded more than Man United this season, so our games have been similarly fun for neutrals and chaotic for us who actually the support the damn bunch. Drawing 4-4 with Luton was particularly f**king wild.

[Neil]

1 hour ago, charlierc said:

I can guess as such. A few weeks later, Newcastle played Man City and had an equaliser chalked off due to questions about an offside player interfering with Hart's vision that most people at the time thought was a bullshit reason, and which I think of as still annoying.

 

But then that's the nature of it. Referees are part of the football mythology, for better or worse.

var is still working out as many said it would its cured nothing of footballs problems, and added a few more.

[charlierc]

Clearly Liverpool and Nottingham Forest aren't the only ones who have a problem with refereeing standards.

 

 

Admittedly it is a surprise to learn La Liga does not use goal-line technology given the Premier League has had this since 2013.

[charlierc]

23 hours ago, Neil said:

var is still working out as many said it would its cured nothing of footballs problems, and added a few more.

Well we can see that in two tranches, given on the one hand you have the fact some decisions seem to be handled by on-pitch and VAR officials leaving it to one another, and on the other offside becoming some hyper-scrutinised.

 

Irony being a clear offside in the Middlesbrough v Leeds Championship game last night not being spotted by on-pitch linos has lead to people wanting it where it isn't. Talk about always wanting what you don't have.

[pink_triangle]

Glad to see Havertz celebrating today, this non celebration nonsense gets on my nerves!

[#1SzigetFan]

So, as I said before, yet another title goes to the 114 fraudsters

Edited April 25 by #1SzigetFan

[thetime]

14 minutes ago, #1SzigetFan said:

So, as I said before, yet another title goes to the 114 fraudsters

 

Can't blame city for Liverpool getting 1 win in 4. In those 4 getting getting 1 point against a sh*t united side, Everton and Palace. 

 

Liverpool should of got 12 points from those fixtures, not 4 points. They would should have 1 hand on the trophy now.

 

Hilarious though.

[#1SzigetFan]

3 minutes ago, thetime said:

Can't blame city for Liverpool getting 1 win in 4. In those 4 getting getting 1 point against a sh*t united side, Everton and Palace. 

 

I can blame PGMOL for costing Liverpool around 10-12 points with VAR. And of course I can blame City for the 114 frauds, that's the main reason why they're the best in the league.

[Gnomicide]

*115

[thetime]

11 hours ago, #1SzigetFan said:

 

I can blame PGMOL for costing Liverpool around 10-12 points with VAR. And of course I can blame City for the 114 frauds, that's the main reason why they're the best in the league.

Not like Liverpool fans blaming others.

[Neil]

On 4/23/2024 at 7:33 PM, charlierc said:

Clearly Liverpool and Nottingham Forest aren't the only ones who have a problem with refereeing standards.

 

 

Admittedly it is a surprise to learn La Liga does not use goal-line technology given the Premier League has had this since 2013.

The UK var advocates like to say how var works well in other countries.

and

its only bad here.

its not the operation which is flawed it's the concept of var.

[Neil]

Remember the endless pub arguments about various decisions that is now the var room .

[charlierc]

4 minutes ago, Neil said:

The UK var advocates like to say how var works well in other countries.

and

its only bad here.

its not the operation which is flawed it's the concept of var.

With La Liga, it's more that they didn't use goal-line technology. Something which, until the weekend, I didn't know as I assumed most big leagues have it, not least given the Premier League has been using that for over a decade, the Championship now uses it and it seems to work just fine when they remember to turn it on (the exception being Villa v Sheffield United in the first game back after lockdown).

Edited April 25 by charlierc

[Gnomicide]

38 minutes ago, thetime said:

Not like Liverpool fans blaming others.

 

Not like United fans to be dickheads.