Paul Currie cancelled by glastonbury

[Nestacres]

Or what actually happened.....BBC News - Soho Theatre: Jewish theatregoers felt 'unsafe' at Paul Currie comedy show

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-68280092

 

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/feb/14/soho-theatre-bans-comedian-paul-currie-jewish-audience-members

Edited April 20 by Nestacres

[Nobody Interesting]

Sounds odd considering Bob Vylan is there - their very vocal views will be spelled out on stage as always............. or are they going to be cancelled?

[Muppetmark]

50 minutes ago, Nestacres said:

Or what actually happened.....BBC News - Soho Theatre: Jewish theatregoers felt 'unsafe' at Paul Currie comedy show

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-68280092

 

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/feb/14/soho-theatre-bans-comedian-paul-currie-jewish-audience-members

If these reports are correct he crossed the line. He picked the worst way to handle it and I see why venues aren't booking him 

[Blisterpack]

He was a prick in the SoHo theatre and by what some have said here he’s been a bit of a prick at glasto. No loss, f**k him. Inclusivity means more than shouting your own opinions and expecting everyone to like them. 

[clarkete]

2 hours ago, BBC7BBCHEAVEN said:

Then again, we live in a "country" where a doctor has been professionally deemed unfit to practice medicine because they had the gall to protest against big oil. 

 

Isn't that still under review? 

 

From Thursday "The tribunal will deliberate on potential sanctions for Dr Benn, which could range from no action to striking her from the medical register."

[CaledonianGonzo]

For further context, there's a long post halfway down this thread from someone who was there at the time

 

https://www.cookdandbombd.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=105718.60#quickreply_anchor

 

As noted elsewhere Currie can be aggressive to audience members and seems to have some other sketchy behaviours, but I dont think this is something they should lose their livelihood over.

[Alex DeLarge]

I've worked at a large event where there was someone who doing an act was asked to do no further slots because they'd included graphic themes without warning the audience. The events policies clearly state that anything to do with potentially triggering topics (sexual abuse, drug addiction, etc)

The BBC got wind of the story and completely blew it out of proportion. Stating he was removed and getting the events name and what it was about wrong. 
 
It was pretty clear to me then how much the media sensationalises stories like this. Paul Currie isn't helping himself by describing the campaign against anti-semitism as extreme zionists though.

[CaledonianGonzo]

I'm sure Toby Young and the Free Speech Union have already rallied to the cause.

Edited April 20 by CaledonianGonzo

[CaledonianGonzo]

FFS having to edit every post I make to fix the pronouns.

[Northtim]

To be fair their whole act has them acting like a spaniel on speed barking (mild)insults at some in the crowd for effect. I guess the truth is they have offended people in this case but getting cancelled and being labelled antisemitic for it is going too far.
 

Lots (most) of us can’t see Israel’s reaction to the Hamas attacks as being reasonable and proportionate - but that is not antisemitism despite efforts from some to label it as that

Edited April 20 by Northtim

[clarkete]

27 minutes ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

For further context, there's a long post halfway down this thread from someone who was there at the time

 

https://www.cookdandbombd.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=105718.60#quickreply_anchor

 

As noted elsewhere Currie can be aggressive to audience members and seems to have some other sketchy behaviours, but I dont think this is something they should lose their livelihood over.

Very interesting to see another perspective from someone there. 

[gigpusher]

2 hours ago, Nobody Interesting said:

Sounds odd considering Bob Vylan is there - their very vocal views will be spelled out on stage as always............. or are they going to be cancelled?

Exactly he has tagged a number of acts who have been very vocal in their pro-Palestine support and yet are still on the bill so it does suggest there is something else also at play here. 

[Mark E. Spliff]

10 hours ago, bamber said:

I love that film, complained when it was rumoured it was beeing pulled from the festival and was mightly releaved when it was revealed that the pulled film story was bullshit, and it was screened. You seem to be suggesting that Glastonbury festival has some sort of pro-Israel bent in its booking policy, I can't see that. 

 

If you're too lazy to just type a few words into Google, then why do you think your view on an issue deserves to be listened to?  In this case, you'd have found all the major newspapers and TV channels confirming that Glastonbury did indeed pull the Corbyn film, along with posts on this forum from me, complaining about it.  The screening which you claim to have attended wasn't put on by the festival in the Pilton Palais, as planned: it was shown in the Speakers' Forum by Reel News as a protest against the festival's decision.  And no - nobody on this thread is claiming Glastonbury has a pro-Israel booking policy.  We're just saying the festival has been cowardly in collapsing under politically-motivated pressure because it's afraid of drawing false accusations of antisemitism.  If you'd watched the Corbyn film, you'd understand the distinction between the two.

 

And talking of people being too lazy to find out...  Where you stand on the Paul Currie issue depends on what you know about what happened.  Although I wasn't there, it's always worth digging deeper when people make claims of the 'we felt unsafe' variety.  The risk with that sort of vague accusation is that it can become a free ticket to shut down voices you don't agree with.  Like the rest of you, I wasn't present at Paul Currie's gig in Soho, but the link posted by CaledonianGonzo above includes an eye-witness account which I'd say looks very genuine - i.e. full of specific detail and not demonising the people involved.  Again - I wasn't there, but in terms of evidence, this account must carry as much weight as the ones the Mail/Telegraph/etc. have been focusing on - i.e. 'this artsy comedy crowd all behaved like beasts and we felt unsafe.'  Very few people will bother to look at that link, so I've cut and pasted it:

 

"I was there on Saturday night. Will be forthcoming with my bias and say that I love Paul Currie and his act. I've seen him about five times over the last decade.

In this show, Schtoom, he doesn't say a single word during the hour.

The bit with the Palestine flag came towards the end of the show. He pulls out the Ukrainian flag from his prop suit case, to cheers from the audience. And then a Palestinian flag to further cheers. I can't remember what the song being played in the background was but it was something up standing up and not staying silent. He them mimes sitting down in front of the tv clicking through the channels at which the point the music switches off. He then mimed gestures to the effect of 'that's you that is', 'makes you think', and 'mind blown.' I know I don't need to explain how comedy works on this forum but it's clearly a bit about how people will display support through slogans but do nothing and forget about it in their day to day life.

If you've seen him before you'll know he essentially acts a like conductor for the audience, getting us to ooh and aah and applause and whoop and boo.

At the end, he urges everyone into a standing ovation using this tactic. Some people in the front row didn't stand, which is fair enough. He asked them why they didn't, if they didn't enjoy the show. I guess this could be considered goading, but it's what he's been doing all night. For example, pointing at people and miming their blank expressions and folded arms and asking them to smile and laugh. Or it could be genuine ask for feedback, you know like most comics do at the end of a gig in a "did you enjoy the show" sort of way.

Now I didn't hear what was said, obviously the audience isn't miced up. But it was something a long the lines of that they did until he showed the Palestinian flag, or they didn't and especially after he showed the flag.

Paul was a bit confused and rattled by it, as was the audience. He wasn't sure if they were being sarcastic or not so he asked them to explain. Again, I didn't hear the explanation. But it did make him angry.

That's when he told them that if they didn't like they can get the f**k out of his show. And for anyone who didn't like it to also get out. A group of people did.

As they were leaving, Paul said they had no idea what they were on about. Paul grew up in Belfast, he understands terrorism and bombing. He's lived through the troubles. Clear emphasis on 'lived' - if there wasn't a ceasefire, he wouldn't here.

I think one other audience member may have also shouted f**k off. But it definitely wasn't 200 people shouting get out. Or free Palestine. People at the back of the room wouldn't have even known entirely what had happened.

I think the audience was a bit confused, I was on row C (though Downstairs at Soho Is set up like cabaret so it's round tables rather than theatre seating). We weren't sure if it was or wasn't a bit. But when he spoke about NI people cheered for him. When he chanted ceasefire now, some of the audience also did.

Also important to say that he condemn Hamas and say he hates terrorism, all terrorism.

He was angry. Of course his is. He's showing solidarity for Palestinian artists, performers and clowns. That we wouldn't have enjoyed his performance if there wasn't a ceasefire because he literally wouldn't have been here.

Also important to say that not once did he say anything about Jewish people or Israel. All he did was show the Palestine flag, and the Ukrainian flag, to mock people who say they care about a cause but do nothing. To be honest, he was mocking me.

He asked to call it what it was. A genocide.

What's really tedious about this is that it takes a quick look at his Instagram to see where his stance lies. I can't imagine paying upwards of £15 to see anyone without looking them up first, and especially to sit on the front row. But maybe that's just me.

This has nothing to do with Soho. Paul has done this show for the three or four day run without incident.

We left soon after so I didn't stay at the bar at the end, not sure if anything happened there.

I wouldn't usually post here but I think it's so important to actually explain what happened, and the context of the actual joke that caused all this. Rather than people on twitter piling on something they don't know anything about.

It's a pretty wild experience to have been part of an audience that is getting all this attention. Really clear to see how all this hate and misinformation spreads.

Also, it's majestic to see that many of the people who are piling on, and one of the Twitter accounts that first posted about this is, are online Terfs. Tells you everything you need to know really.

Paul Currie is sweet clown and must be protected at all costs."

[Blisterpack]

22 minutes ago, gigpusher said:

Exactly he has tagged a number of acts who have been very vocal in their pro-Palestine support and yet are still on the bill so it does suggest there is something else also at play here. 

The targeting of the Jewish audience members was antisemitic. Anyone who argues otherwise is either antisemitic themselves or happy to defend it for some other reason. 

[gigpusher]

1 minute ago, Blisterpack said:

The targeting of the Jewish audience members was antisemitic. Anyone who argues otherwise is either antisemitic themselves or happy to defend it for some other reason. 

From his statement he has said he didn’t know they were Jewish. If he didn’t I don’t know how it could be antisemitism.  I don’t know him and wasn’t there so obviously can’t argue his point but if he is just a confrontational comedian who argued with them because they didn’t participate in part of his routine I’m not sure he is. 
 

His act doesn’t sound brilliant to me and as I said it feels like there must be something more to it because other artists who have a very pro-Palestinian stance are on the bill. 

[Mark E. Spliff]

2 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

The targeting of the Jewish audience members was antisemitic. Anyone who argues otherwise is either antisemitic themselves or happy to defend it for some other reason. 

Very good point mate.

 

I was sitting in the front row of a Thora Hird concert when she turned on my redneck friend and criticised his 'Make America Great Again' baseball cap and Trump tee-shirt.  I couldn't believe how racist she is towards the American people.

[Blisterpack]

2 minutes ago, Mark E. Spliff said:

Very good point mate.

 

I was sitting in the front row of a Thora Hird concert when she turned on my redneck friend and criticised his 'Make America Great Again' baseball cap and Trump tee-shirt.  I couldn't believe how racist she is towards the American people.

Except you didn’t. 

[Blisterpack]

14 minutes ago, gigpusher said:

From his statement he has said he didn’t know they were Jewish. If he didn’t I don’t know how it could be antisemitism.  I don’t know him and wasn’t there so obviously can’t argue his point but if he is just a confrontational comedian who argued with them because they didn’t participate in part of his routine I’m not sure he is. 
 

His act doesn’t sound brilliant to me and as I said it feels like there must be something more to it because other artists who have a very pro-Palestinian stance are on the bill. 

Is the pro-Palestine stance you support the two state solution that the Arabs have rejected numerous times or the one that treats women and LGBTQ+ people as third rate citizens? I suspect Hamas/ Islamic Jihad/Hezbollah and all the other cranks that Israel - one of the first Nations on the planet to legalise homosexuality and abortion - fights off on a daily basis will not be over impressed with Emily’s efforts on diversity and inclusivity. 

Edited April 20 by Blisterpack

[Mark E. Spliff]

8 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

Except you didn’t. 

Whooooooooooossssshhhhhhhh.

[Blisterpack]

1 minute ago, Mark E. Spliff said:

Whooooooooooossssshhhhhhhh.

Not a woosh mate. Pointing out the ludicrous nature of the comparison. 

[Jay Pee]

I have never seen his show at Glastonbury or elsewhere but he seems a bit of a d*ck.

 

His not being there will have zero impact for, I am guessing, 99% of attendees of the festival and i fully understand why the organisers made the decision they did.  he should try being less of a d*ck perhaps?  or is that his raison d'etre?

 

How many flags do you see at festivals saying "don't be a d*ck"?

Edited April 20 by Jay Pee

[Looother]

1 hour ago, BBC7BBCHEAVEN said:

"I think Israel are nothing more than a fascist state running on racism"

 

I'm relatively new here, and this might make me unpopular, but here goes:

 

As a left-wing Jew one concern I have about this year's Glastonbury is the likelihood that I'll be exposed to the combination of ignorance and antisemitism that has been allowed into the open, particularly on the British left, in the last six months. That's not to say that Israel's government, military, settlement policies etc etc don't deserve strong criticism and Palestinians strong support, and I am expecting to see both, but people have to be very careful with their language if they want to avoid causing offense.

 

At Coachella for example towards the end of Young Fathers' set Graham Hastings shouted "Ceasefire now!" and "Free Palestine!". I don't really have an issue with that, but I'd say that ideally it should be something like: Ceasefire now - Free the hostages - Overthrow Hamas - Free Palestine. Hastings didn't say anything that suggests he supports Hamas or that he does not support innocent Israelis, but I did find the omissions curious (and I find the perception among some on the left that Hamas are defending the oppressed rather than another means of oppression completely bizarre). Really I think if someone with a significant public profile wants to state their opinion they should ideally make the effort to actually form one, something cohesive and suggestive of independent thought and genuine conviction, rather than just say a couple of random slogans. 

With Paul Currie, I think he clearly handled that moment poorly, but nothing I have read has remotely convinced me it demonstrated that he is an antisemite. I also have very profound issues with the Campaign Against Antisemitism's methodology. "We have contacted Paul Currie for comment", as they put it in their initial release about the incident, is nowhere near good enough, given the potential (and actual) impact of that release on Currie's career. There is real and rational fear of rising antisemitism in the British Jewish community, and while intending to protect them from the antisemitism the CAA also sometimes seem willing to weaponise the fear.

 

Finally, I hope people avoid the temptation to make inflammatory and unnecessary comments, such as the one I've quoted above. It isn't necessarily antisemitic, but there was no need in the context of the rest of the post to make it at all and it seems, at best, wilfully provocative. 

 

Happy to discuss any of this either online or over a pint on the farm.

[Alex DeLarge]

Can't imagine much good is going to come of this thread tbh.

[efcfanwirral]

37 minutes ago, gigpusher said:

From his statement he has said he didn’t know they were Jewish. If he didn’t I don’t know how it could be antisemitism.  I don’t know him and wasn’t there so obviously can’t argue his point but if he is just a confrontational comedian who argued with them because they didn’t participate in part of his routine I’m not sure he is. 
 

His act doesn’t sound brilliant to me and as I said it feels like there must be something more to it because other artists who have a very pro-Palestinian stance are on the bill. 

The festival giving away 20 pairs of tickets with the entry requirements of donating to Palestine doesn't indicate a pro Israel stance. Definitely something more, maybe it is simply the concern that this person might do something similar at Glastonbury in calling out individual audience members and it ending up in the press? More an issue with the method than the message?

Edited April 20 by efcfanwirral

[gigpusher]

16 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

Is the pro-Palestine stance you support the two state solution that the Arabs have rejected numerous times or the one that treats women and LGBTQ+ people as third rate citizens? I suspect Hamas/ Islamic Jihad/Hezbollah and all the other cranks that Israel - one of the first Nations on the planet to legalise homosexuality and abortion - fights off on a daily basis will not be over impressed with Emily’s efforts on diversity and inclusivity. 

I'm not sure why you seem to be targeting my replies, firstly look at my replies and all I have said is other artists who have voiced pro-Palestinian views are on the bill. I haven't actually mentioned my own views on the topic at all.

 

If you are interested in my view, my view is that governments of countries should be seen to take a stance against terrorism but that it should be proportionate. The government of Israel have lost all legitimacy in my eyes for behaving in an appalling manner which has been completely disproportionate and has only put their own hostages in further danger. I believe this is exactly how many Jewish people in Israel also feel. I don't blame Jewish people for this I blame a horrendous right wing government. I was brought up as catholic in the Republic of Ireland and moved to Manchester the year after the IRA bombed it. I am more than aware of how it feels to feel targeted and to be on the receiving end of abuse for something that you don't condone or agree with.

 

My only must see of the entire festival so far is a Jewish artist. I don't hold her responsible for the actions of the Israeli government.